IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#21  Postby 3sgem » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:17 pm

TwinTurbo wrote:Entries so far;
O2L

Michael Hazelton

Late entries are available until this Friday 21ST APRIL 2017 COB 1700hrs

Cheers
Gary


Good to see you back Mr Hazelton!
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#22  Postby mikrace » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:22 pm

TwinTurbo wrote:
mikrace wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:30 cars
Would make a great field
Would be some great racing
Would be a car every 150m
Would be great to see the smaller cars monstering the bigger ones around the Brabham loops
Sigh, but alas, sigh

Might be "great to see" but would be highly frustrating to be involved ](*,)
Simple maths, combined grids = many less U2L cars, so there wouldn't be 30 anyway :idea:
I didn't see your name on the list :?:

It's ok Bruce. We just need to gain enough support for a separate 2-3L grid and the problem goes away....
Everyone has their own views and reasons on this and I know Gary will quote data that supports his case from other states compared to NSW like has before. I do think it would be sad to think the u2L competitors wouldn't race if the grids were combined. I gather the reasoning would be cause they would get frustrated (as Gary suggests) being stuck behind *edit slower bigger powered cars... but that is the same for everyone in o2L not in an LMv8!!

We lost 2 x Evo competitors this year (compared to last year) due to that same frustration Mik, probably makes around 30 competitors lost for the same reason over the last decade. I'm not so sure about the "everyone in O2L not in an LMV8", there is no reason for the EMV8's to be any slower than the LMV8's in a straight line. Even then it didn't stop a non V8 (EM or LM) winning the O2L IPRANSW championship last year.

Cheers
Gary


Even though I don't want to bomb this thread or argue with you on this, I will clarify that an EMv8 has much less corner speed than an LMv8 with better chassis, tyre (width, diameter and profile) and rims than the EMv8. So i have witnessed them to be less bothersome to the less powered cars.

So the Evo's left due to not being fast enough down the straights? I would have thought it was due to gearbox issues :roll: :lol: :lol:

I do think the joined grids are better to watch. To race with it's no difference to me as we are all in the same category and should be having fun racing in a diverse and exciting field.
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#23  Postby mikrace » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:24 pm

3sgem wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:Entries so far;
O2L

Michael Hazelton

Late entries are available until this Friday 21ST APRIL 2017 COB 1700hrs

Cheers
Gary


Good to see you back Mr Hazelton!


Thanks!! I am very nervous... not about driving, but about keeping the car alive all weekend!!! Haha.

Should be a nice calm and stress free weekend playing in the midfield somewhere :)
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#24  Postby mikrace » Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:44 pm

Will anyone have class stickers on Saturday?
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#25  Postby Born Again Racer » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:12 pm

TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:30 cars
Would make a great field
Would be some great racing
Would be a car every 150m
Would be great to see the smaller cars monstering the bigger ones around the Brabham loops
Sigh, but alas, sigh

Might be "great to see" but would be highly frustrating to be involved ](*,)
Simple maths, combined grids = many less U2L cars, so there wouldn't be 30 anyway :idea:
I didn't see your name on the list :?:

Cheers
Gary



Have you considered that the decrease in O2L cars this year has been caused by not having combined grids?
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#26  Postby TwinTurbo » Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:22 pm

Born Again Racer wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:30 cars
Would make a great field
Would be some great racing
Would be a car every 150m
Would be great to see the smaller cars monstering the bigger ones around the Brabham loops
Sigh, but alas, sigh

Might be "great to see" but would be highly frustrating to be involved ](*,)
Simple maths, combined grids = many less U2L cars, so there wouldn't be 30 anyway :idea:
I didn't see your name on the list :?:

Have you considered that the decrease in O2L cars this year has been caused by not having combined grids?

As Mik said, the overwhelming evidence hasn't supported that view for the ~20 years that we have been running separate grids. Added to the evidence from other States makes a compelling argument.

Cheers
Gary
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#27  Postby mikrace » Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:16 am

TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:30 cars
Would make a great field
Would be some great racing
Would be a car every 150m
Would be great to see the smaller cars monstering the bigger ones around the Brabham loops
Sigh, but alas, sigh

Might be "great to see" but would be highly frustrating to be involved ](*,)
Simple maths, combined grids = many less U2L cars, so there wouldn't be 30 anyway :idea:
I didn't see your name on the list :?:

Have you considered that the decrease in O2L cars this year has been caused by not having combined grids?

As Mik said, the overwhelming evidence hasn't supported that view for the ~20 years that we have been running separate grids. Added to the evidence from other States makes a compelling argument.

Cheers
Gary


I get that for your beloved u2L Gary, but is there evidence that Bruce is wrong about o2L not thriving without the combined grids though?
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#28  Postby TwinTurbo » Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:03 am

mikrace wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:30 cars
Would make a great field
Would be some great racing
Would be a car every 150m
Would be great to see the smaller cars monstering the bigger ones around the Brabham loops
Sigh, but alas, sigh

Might be "great to see" but would be highly frustrating to be involved ](*,)
Simple maths, combined grids = many less U2L cars, so there wouldn't be 30 anyway :idea:
I didn't see your name on the list :?:

Have you considered that the decrease in O2L cars this year has been caused by not having combined grids?

As Mik said, the overwhelming evidence hasn't supported that view for the ~20 years that we have been running separate grids. Added to the evidence from other States makes a compelling argument.

I get that for your beloved u2L Gary, but is there evidence that Bruce is wrong about o2L not thriving without the combined grids though?

I also believe that there is overwhelming evidence that the reason for the diminution in new O2L cars is the "R" word. Demonstrably the number of O2L cars that have left due to problems caused by the "R" word would easily fill their own grid. Or at the very least a combined grid with LMV8's. Hence leaving space to promote a separate 2L to 3L grid and get those cars out of the garages, dusted off and onto the track racing where they should be.

The obvious effect of the "R" word can not be ignored having just been to Bathurst for the Easter 6 Hour, where there were so many cars running that should be in IP. But never will be.

Cheers
Gary
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#29  Postby Gridfilla » Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:11 am

mikrace wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:
TwinTurbo wrote:
Born Again Racer wrote:30 cars
Would make a great field
Would be some great racing
Would be a car every 150m
Would be great to see the smaller cars monstering the bigger ones around the Brabham loops
Sigh, but alas, sigh

Might be "great to see" but would be highly frustrating to be involved ](*,)
Simple maths, combined grids = many less U2L cars, so there wouldn't be 30 anyway :idea:
I didn't see your name on the list :?:

Have you considered that the decrease in O2L cars this year has been caused by not having combined grids?

As Mik said, the overwhelming evidence hasn't supported that view for the ~20 years that we have been running separate grids. Added to the evidence from other States makes a compelling argument.

Cheers
Gary


I get that for your beloved u2L Gary, but is there evidence that Bruce is wrong about o2L not thriving without the combined grids though?


Perhaps no evidence apart from dwindling numbers......
So over 2 litre cars are not running because there is not enough cars to beat or to look good as part of??
C'mon Mik, not even you can draw the bow this far :wink:
The problem is not that simple and has no easy fix. Changes touted in the last meeting will certainly help turn things around but even then the big events like Bathurst, Clipsal and Nationals are the main distractions to field entries.
Imagine for a moment Mik, if you were able to have a seperate grid of 2-3 litre cars and race it for 5 - 10 years after finally getting away from V8's that hosed you on the straight ....... Then someone suggests it is better for the V8's if you were all back together. I don't think you would let it go that easily either.
David Waldon is coming back from Qld for another round and I bet it is so he can run with a similar group of cars and have real opportunity to take a podium and be seen to do so - the split grids work. Lets fix WHY overs cars are not entering rather than padding them out with Under 2 litre cars and risking two grids shrinking.
Back to the Silvia to stick all the bits back in before end of month ](*,)
Newbies at the back move the old tail enders to mid pack !!
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#30  Postby Sprintparts » Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:19 am

Born Again Racer wrote:
Have you considered that the decrease in O2L cars this year has been caused by not having combined grids?


Have you considered that the increase in U2L cars this year has been caused by not having combined grids?

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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#31  Postby switch » Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:28 am

I wanted to race in combined grids but unfortunately the car had other ideas... i am probably one of the few U2L guys that find combined grids attractive but I am newish so havent had the time to become jaded :lol:

As for the Evo's its the same old, same old. Steve has left to go race prod touring, a place where he can run without a restrictor yet would still not get anywhere near the O2L lap records where he would have run with a restrictor. Michael is taking a bit of time off. He did a Fosc race recently sans restrictor and had a great time to boot so its hard to imagine he will come back anytime soon.

Herein lies the issue, we want more competitors yet we do nothing to attract them. Its not hard to see why numbers are falling..
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#32  Postby mikrace » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:02 am

Thanks for the responses guys. Yes we all know the air restrictor on boosted cars is a massive issue with o2L numbers.

For the record, I have no issue racing LMv8's or getting blown away down the straights. The big power u2L cars are faster than me down the straight, never mind the good rotaries or the restricted turbos. I have no problem at all with the challenge of trying to get in front enough not to lose the spot down the straight. It's one of the things i love about IP - different cars have different strengths and the driver needs to take advantage of them.

"So over 2 litre cars are not running because there is not enough cars to beat or to look good as part of??" - It could be part of the problem. In NSW we don't have many o2L cars in the tail pack, where as in Vic they have a much larger tail pack. Maybe Vic gets its depth of different speed cars cause the class of e30's are there to race against? But it is true that we don't want to risk the success of u2L with the small potential of retaining o2L cars if it is combined grids.
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#33  Postby mikrace » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:04 am

mikrace wrote:Will anyone have class stickers on Saturday?
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#34  Postby TwinTurbo » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:26 am

mikrace wrote:
mikrace wrote:Will anyone have class stickers on Saturday?

Ian Price is the man.

Cheers
Gary
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#35  Postby mikrace » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:55 am

TwinTurbo wrote:
mikrace wrote:
mikrace wrote:Will anyone have class stickers on Saturday?

Ian Price is the man.

Cheers
Gary


Thanks Gary.
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#36  Postby Electro » Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:34 pm

I have entered, but I am waiting to hear if I can get a garage or carport.
If I cannot get one or the other, I probably will not run.
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#37  Postby mikrace » Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:52 pm

Electro wrote:I have entered, but I am waiting to hear if I can get a garage or carport.
If I cannot get one or the other, I probably will not run.


All the cool kids will be up the back on the SKIIIDZ pad.... Probably getting D&B graffiti all over our cars now Macka isn't racing and will be bored! :lol: :lol:
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#38  Postby 3sgem » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:44 pm

Gridfilla wrote:Perhaps no evidence apart from dwindling numbers......
So over 2 litre cars are not running because there is not enough cars to beat or to look good as part of??
C'mon Mik, not even you can draw the bow this far :wink:
The problem is not that simple and has no easy fix. Changes touted in the last meeting will certainly help turn things around but even then the big events like Bathurst, Clipsal and Nationals are the main distractions to field entries.


I think that maybe the O2L no's are due to 3 high profile events virtually back to back. These 3 had good O2L no's and all cost heaps to run so have depleted some of of Overs guys.

P.I. Nats, Bathurst 12Hr & Clipsal. :!:
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#39  Postby TwinTurbo » Sat Apr 22, 2017 9:57 am

3sgem wrote:
Gridfilla wrote:Perhaps no evidence apart from dwindling numbers......
So over 2 litre cars are not running because there is not enough cars to beat or to look good as part of??
C'mon Mik, not even you can draw the bow this far :wink:
The problem is not that simple and has no easy fix. Changes touted in the last meeting will certainly help turn things around but even then the big events like Bathurst, Clipsal and Nationals are the main distractions to field entries.

I think that maybe the O2L no's are due to 3 high profile events virtually back to back. These 3 had good O2L no's and all cost heaps to run so have depleted some of of Overs guys.
P.I. Nats, Bathurst 12Hr & Clipsal. :!:

Nationals happen every year and Bathurst has been on the calendar for a long time, so there is plenty of opportunity for people to budget for them. In contrast I did warn about the cost in lost competitors to the various State Championships when Clipsal was suddenly, out of the blue, announced and I copped nothing but abuse for it. Without picking on any one in any way, NSW did have 4 cars competing at Clipsal and 3 of them have not been seen since at a race meeting. At the same time as warning of the financial cost I did also warn of the risks of damage to the cars in racing on a temporary street circuit with limited run off areas and lots of concrete walls.

Please don't read this as some sort of "I told you so", that's not the intention in any way. What is relevant is that there is a cost to State Championships in high profile high cost events and that needs to be recognised before we jump at what may seem like an opportunity too good to miss. There are consequences and they shouldn't be dismissed lightly.

Cheers
Gary
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Re: IPRANSW Round 3 2017 - SMSP Long Circuit

Post Number:#40  Postby FatBoy » Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:21 am

Ever considered that the other 3 guys had only planned on running at a select few events this year instead of doing a whole season ?
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